[00:00:00] Adrienne Donnelly: Welcome to the Seed to Success podcast, where we deep dive into the strategy, stories, and smart decisions that help VAs and OBMs grow and thrive. I'm your host Adrienne Donnelly, and whether you're just starting out or looking for ways to take your business to the next level, you're in the right place. Now, let's get into today's conversation.
[00:00:23] Adrienne Donnelly: All right, today we are joined, by Sez from Whale Tail Digital, wanna make sure I get that [00:00:30] right. Welcome to the pod, Sez.
[00:00:32] Sez Gower: Thank you, thank you for having me
[00:00:33] Adrienne Donnelly: Of course we are talking today all things sustainable websites, and I'm so excited to learn about this. It came up recently in one of our inner circle brainstorming sessions, and a few of us were like, Ooh, tell us more and we're like, this is a great opportunity for a podcast. So let's get straight into it. In terms of, let's start with the basics. What does it mean to have, or what is a sustainable [00:01:00] website?
[00:01:00] Sez Gower: So a sustainable website is people, obviously when they hear sustainability, they think about generally the environmental impact of something. So that does come into it but the sustainable website is not just good for the planet, it's also good for people. So it's making sure that the website is accessible and inclusive so that people can use the website no matter their age, race, their environment that they happen to be in, in terms of if they have, you know, [00:01:30] terrible internet or anything like that. So it's basically websites that are better. The way I call it is websites that are better for people and planet.
[00:02:01] Sez Gower: The planet side of it, in terms of the environmental impact is we're trying to minimise the environmental impact in terms of the carbon footprint because a little known fact and that people probably don't consider until you sort of mention it, is that everything we do online has a digital carbon footprint, or rather, our digital lives create a carbon footprint in the real world, which has an environmental impact in, the physical world.
[00:02:02] Adrienne Donnelly: Mm, it's so fascinating. So there's sort of two parts, the environmental side of things and the, accessibility and ensuring that our websites are inclusive for everyone. Let's start with the environmental impacts of websites. What are some of the things that we probably aren't aware of that our websites are having an impact on when it comes to the environmental and that sort of carbon footprint that you've mentioned?
[00:02:27] Sez Gower: So essentially the way that it works [00:02:30] is that every bit of data, any of the data that travels around the internet it's not, the easiest way I supposed to explain it is when we talk about the cloud, it's not like a physical cloud. It's not just that goes into disappears. The cloud and the internet are actually made up of data centers and data servers that are placed all over the world. Now, these data servers run on electricity, just like everything else in the world. Um, and with that electricity that's where the carbon footprint comes [00:03:00] from because the amount of energy that is required to, run these data servers, 24 7 basically because of all of the internet that is flying back and forth all day. Uh, that's where the carbon footprint comes from. So what you've got is basically the more energy that a website requires, IE if the page is what we call heavy. So that means that it's got a lot of media on it, or if it hasn't been, uh, compressed or optimised, the more energy it requires, the more electricity is needed to power [00:03:30] those data servers. And that's where you get the increase in the carbon footprint.
[00:03:34] Adrienne Donnelly: I think you may have just explained the cloud in the most simple way I've ever, I think there's a movie with Cameron Diaz and she has this line and she's like, no one knows what the cloud is, but we trust it anyway and we do like you, you know, but you've just explained that in such a great way that it, the, the cloud is basically these data centers, and I know in my, VA business, I have clients that will pick software and tech based on where the data [00:04:00] center is housed and the security. You've just connected a lot of dots, so I hope the listeners and the watchers are having these great aha moments with us. You mentioned two words there, compressed and optimised. Could you say a bit more about what that means when we are thinking about our own website.
[00:04:18] Sez Gower: Yeah.
[00:04:18] Sez Gower: So essentially when it comes to the compression and optimisation, the compression generally refers more to the images. That's the thing that most people are going to understand how to compress them. So essentially with an image file, um, and this will get a little bit, sort of too techy, but I'm coming from a photographer's point of view, 'cause I also do photography.
[00:04:38] Sez Gower: If we talk about the images, like say from a photographer's perspective, when you have an image that comes raw out of a camera, that may be like a 40 megapixel image or even bigger than that, if it is converted into a jpeg, it essentially flattens all the data in it and it means that it's compressed the file. So instead of having a 40 [00:05:00] megapixel image, you might have like a two megapixel image or something to that effect. The thing with website images is you can compress them even further. There are tools online like tiny jpg.com, which basically strips out any data that isn't needed in the image.
[00:05:14] Sez Gower: That's things like, and this is where it does get a bit technical, things like the X of data, which is things like who took the image, what editing, you know, tools that's been through, and all of that sort of stuff. That's information that people accessing an image on the web, don't need to know. So it [00:05:30] strips out that sort of information and compresses the actual data of the image so that it retains a certain amount of quality, but it's also a much smaller file size. And we wanna get the file sizes as small as possible for the web. And there's a couple of reasons, not just for the, carbon footprint 'cause obviously less data means less electricity, but it also means that the site will load a lot faster because it's not every bit of data that is loading on a website, it adds to the site load time. And we wanna try and get [00:06:00] that as low as possible because gone are the days when people used to, you know, put in a, a website URL, and then go and make a coffee waiting for
[00:06:09] Adrienne Donnelly: Waiting for the dial up. Waiting for the dial internet
[00:06:11] Sez Gower: Those days are long gone. Exactly those days are long gone. So what we wanna do is try and get the site loading as quickly as possible and having compressed images is one way of doing that. The optimisation side of things for sites that is a little bit different depending on who people are. You know, what platform they're using [00:06:30] for their website. I use WordPress, particularly because I know that I can get a lot better um results Using different tools to optimise my website and because I know the back end of it, whereas things like Showit, Squarespace and Wix, they probably do have some optimisation tools, but you may not be able to do it quite to the same extent because they are actually offering those as hosted websites rather than WordPress where you're self-hosting.
[00:06:55] Adrienne Donnelly: Okay. This is really great and you're doing a very good job of explaining quite [00:07:00] technical in a way that the non-techies can understand.
[00:07:04] Sez Gower: I know that it's, it's, it's a very, very full on subject. And it's something that even me, I mean, I've been building websites for like 25 years now. I started back in the days of hand coding HTML when I was in high school. But it is something that, it's gonna be a little bit different for every platform and, and for everyone at different levels. But yeah, the, the easiest way I suppose to explain it is that all of the data that a [00:07:30] website is made up of, all those ones and zeros, there are ways of compressing it and optimising it, so it's a much smaller bundle than if it was uncompressed when it's just sending like every bit of data to you. So, yeah.
[00:07:42] Adrienne Donnelly: I think you touched on something really important there around the ux, like the user experience and what, what we refer to is how the user, I'm sorry if I butcher this, but basically how a user experiences your website and whether that's, you know, a good or a bad experience is something that I think people might be [00:08:00] potentially worried about is if I do all of this compressing and optimising is the user, my customer, and my client still going to have a great experience and it sounds like you're coming at it from a really balanced perspective to have a great experience, but also, um, minimal impact.
[00:08:16] Sez Gower: Yeah, I mean, it, it is a balancing act and I mean, I, I've created templates and websites that got a fantastic carbon rating, A's or A pluses. Um, have a wonderful user experience. [00:08:30] You know, but there's still enough sort of bells and whistles there, they're still professionally created in that. But I suppose that's the thing is that I know that there are some websites out there, and I find it particularly with photography websites, obviously, because the photographer, their website is their online portfolio. They need to have a lot of images. For those ones, it can be harder. To get them to that level of optimisation and that level of, um, compression with their images just because there's so much more data. But it is possible and the user experience, what it really comes down to is just [00:09:00] making things as easy for people to access as possible.
[00:09:03] Adrienne Donnelly: So it even comes down to things like the navigation, of the site. You wanna make things as easy as possible for your clients to see and also, I mean, that even has an energy flow on effect because if you're putting things in a way that it's going to be easy for people to find. They're not going to be spending time, you know, rabbit holing all around your website looking for what they need, which then creates more, you know, data, more of a carbon footprint. [00:09:30] Good UX actually ties in with having a, carbon conscious website, so all of it, it's, it's.
[00:09:37] Sez Gower: Uh, the thing I've noticed the most since I dove into this subject is how everything is all tied in together. So, good UX is, is part of having a carbon friendly website, having everything compressed and optimised, and even the flow on effect from all of that is that all of these things also are great for SEO. So it's sort of like, you know, why wouldn't you do it if, if you have that [00:10:00] opportunity?
[00:10:00] Adrienne Donnelly: Yeah. Everyone's a winner. I wanna ask you some tips for people that they can change on their website, but first, how did you get into this area?
[00:10:12] Adrienne Donnelly: You mentioned you've been building websites for 25 years, so you obviously started when you were 10 or so. Go with it. Go with it. Um, how did you get into this specific area?
[00:10:23] Sez Gower: Mm. Yeah, it's, um, it's funny. I mean, I've always been very environmentally [00:10:30] focused. It's something that I've always been sort of, you know, really interested in, uh, but specifically about environmentally friendly websites, it came about last year. The WP Mavens, Emma, Kate, and Haley, held a summit called the Women of Web Summit, which was basically for women web designers and they had someone there, Sandy Dähnert from Green the Web, and she is, uh, a web designer who deals with, eco-friendly websites. She's got fantastic website. I definitely recommend everyone go and check it out. [00:11:00] But her talk was on, lowering the environmental impact of websites.
[00:11:03] Sez Gower: And it was just sort of like, you know, I was immediately in, I thought, my God, this is something that not only does it feel really personal to me because of my connection to the environment and the ocean and, and whales and everything, but also because people are turning to more sustainable options. There is so much information out there about the climate crisis and how we can make changes in our [00:11:30] lives and the thing is that, yes, while things like, you know, the fossil fuel companies and everything, obviously the major polluters in the world, there are still things that we can do in our lives no matter how small, but they do still add up and so this is something I was just like, yes, this is something I want to do that sets me apart in the market because I can make an impact in this way. I can help my clients with this and know that I'm making a change in the environment. So, yeah, it, it just seemed like an absolute no brainer. I was just immediately, all [00:12:00] in as soon as I found out about it.
[00:12:01] Adrienne Donnelly: You must have come away from that summit just being like, let's do this.
[00:12:07] Sez Gower: Buzzing, seriously buzzing. I was kind of
[00:12:09] Adrienne Donnelly: I can see.
[00:12:09] Sez Gower: diving into everything.
[00:12:10] Adrienne Donnelly: Yeah, I can see it when you talk about it. Yeah, I can hear it in your voice.
[00:12:15] Sez Gower: It was funny because what I've, I looked into originally is she was talking about sustainable websites. So that was the tack that I was taking because I thought, better for people and planet, hell yes, absolutely sign me up for that. But I know that there are some occasions where the [00:12:30] people side of things is not gonna be, we won't be able to get everything completely accessible depending on how people have set things up or how their branding has been done, but I can always do my absolute best to lower the carbon footprint as much as possible. And so that's basically what I say now to any people who sign up with me, any of my clients, is you may not have come to me for an eco-friendly website, but that's what you're gonna get when you work with me because that's my thing. So yeah.
[00:12:56] Adrienne Donnelly: It's fantastic and yeah, very, whether you're listening or [00:13:00] you're watching, it's very clear that it's something that absolutely lights you up. And it's so true because we focus, and especially over the last, I don't know five to 10 years there has been such a focus on our education around sustainability and what decisions that we can make as consumers. Um, but I feel like there's always been very much a product focus on those changes that we can make. And what I really love is that you're then taking that to another [00:13:30] level and applying it to digital choices that we can make, not just, you know, sustainable products and, um, you know, the decisions we can make in our households and in our offices and things like that. But also in the digital space, which is really, really cool. Really cool.
[00:13:46] Sez Gower: Yeah. Yeah.
[00:13:47] Adrienne Donnelly: If there's VAs and OBMs that are listening, and I don't know if anyone's like me. When I first started my business, I didn't have a budget for a website. I, I put something together myself. I just got something together, um, [00:14:00] or so whether they've built it themselves or they have brought in someone that can help them build it on whatever platform, are there certain things that we can start doing either on our own sites or having whoever built it?
[00:14:14] Adrienne Donnelly: Or obviously they can come to you as well, and we'll have all your information in the episode description, but small changes that we can be making on our websites to start moving in the right direction of a more sustainable website for our own businesses.
[00:14:28] Sez Gower: Yeah, [00:14:30] absolutely. So the biggest thing is essentially trying to decrease the size of the pages. Um, the first thing is basically to get the awareness to know exactly what you're working with. So I would suggest going to any of the website carbon calculators. There are three that I tend to use for all of my client sites because it gives a really good sort of average. So the first one is websitecarbon.com. Nice and easy to remember. The second one is ecograder.com, as in getting a grade on your eco friendliness. [00:15:00] And the last one is digitalbeacon.co. So each of those will give you not just what their rating is between like an A plus to an F, but it will also tell you how, uh, how large the page is in terms of, kilobytes.
[00:15:15] Sez Gower: So how much data there is, and also how many grams of carbon each page load will take. So that will at least give you a starting point, so you can know, okay, I've gotta get it smaller than that. So once you've got those, the first thing I generally do for people is [00:15:30] check out what their media library is like. That's what it's called in WordPress, but where any of the images are saved and I go and check to see what the images are doing. Because the great thing about any of those carbon calculator reports, uh, sites, is that they will also give you generally tips on things that you can make the changes, like what is the biggest contributing factor.
[00:15:51] Sez Gower: So the main thing I generally see on any sites where I've done an eco-friendly site visualisation is images. I had one recently for a white label client where we [00:16:00] had three images the smallest of them was eight megapixels, the largest was about 13. Um, so yeah, once I had done the full site optimisation and compressed the images, we ended up slashing their carbon footprint by about 96%. Huge, huge difference and a lot of that was just contributed to actually compressing the images 'cause they'd obviously uploaded like the original images in their full ridiculous size. Um, so that would be the first thing. And for [00:16:30] that, the easiest ways that I've found to actually fix up your images, check to see what the actual file dimensions are.
[00:16:38] Sez Gower: You don't want anything that's gonna be like 4,000 by 3000 megapixels. That's way too big for any website. To be honest the largest image that I will have is if you have something as either a background or like a hero image and I'll make sure that the width of it is about 25 60 pixels. That's as large as it needs to go. It doesn't need to be any larger than that. Um, and then any other images that are on the website, [00:17:00] usually the largest side, the longer side, whether it's vertical or horizontal, will be 1600 pixels. Nothing needs to be above that because it's just extra data and it's not required. So the first thing I do is resize the images and then you can, once you've saved them as a jpeg, you can then you know run them through a compressor like Tiny JPG and what I've found with a lot of them is that you'll start with an uncompressed huge image that's maybe about eight megapixels, and I can get it down to about 200 kilobytes. That's a huge [00:17:30] difference in the size of the webpage. Um, media is definitely where the worst of it comes from in terms of the data that contributes to the site. So be really careful when including any video or audio or anything like that
[00:17:43] Adrienne Donnelly: I was gonna ask you about Yeah. how it plays out
[00:17:46] Sez Gower: Yeah. So,
[00:17:47] Adrienne Donnelly: in other media types.
[00:17:48] Sez Gower: yeah, I mean, it's fine to include video because I know people want to, I, I know that there are a lot of sites out there that have, uh, including video as like the background of a hero section. I [00:18:00] wouldn't do it because unless you can compress that out the wazoo, it's gonna be heavy. It's going to make your site slow to load, and it's going to contribute a lot of data to the site. With any videos that I embed, I always make sure that they don't autoplay, so it'll have like a thumbnail that I'll show up first and then people have to click on them to play them. The other thing I generally recommend for that is host them on somewhere like YouTube or Vimeo, Vimeo, whichever you wanna prefer. Purely because those platforms have been built specifically to stream and [00:18:30] host videos, whereas if you host it on your own website, it's contributing to the data load and the server load and it's going to make the site a lot slower, to load as well.
[00:18:38] Sez Gower: So for some, for things like those, I would definitely probably just pop it up on YouTube. The other thing with media that I can recommend, particularly if it's video. But also audio, I suppose, uh,
[00:18:49] Adrienne Donnelly: And also, uh, ensures that your website's a bit more inclusive, I guess, in terms of how people are coming to a site and additional tools or apps that they may be using to [00:19:00] move through your website. And I know in our inner circle membership, you're going to be doing a masterclass on that topic around creating inclusive and accessible websites, which I'm equally as excited for. You've mentioned a whole bunch of tips and, websites and, tools. So we'll make sure all of those are in the episode descriptions. You mentioned the websites that will grade your website. Um, you mentioned the site that will compress the, uh, images are there any [00:19:30] other tools or apps or anything else in your tech stack that you really recommend when it comes to building sustainable websites?
[00:19:37] Sez Gower: Probably not
[00:20:02] Sez Gower: So it's funny actually, 'cause I obviously, as I mentioned before, that I work exclusively with WordPress websites because there are so many tools in there that I know that I can use to help further optimise the website, and that's how I get such a good result. When it comes to things like Squarespace, WIX, Showit, or any of the other website platforms, because they're all hosted websites, a lot of that optimisation is done on their servers already, and there's not too much more that you can really do.
[00:20:05] Sez Gower: So for those people who have those websites hosted with them I don't really have any suggestions unfortunately but for WordPress websites, what I would absolutely recommend is get a caching plugin. So there are free ones available WP Optimise uh, Lightspeed Cache are really good, they're both free. I use an industry standard one called WP Rocket, and it is phenomenal. It has been one of the tools that has helped me [00:20:30] the most with optimising websites.
[00:20:32] Sez Gower: I would also recommend with actually anyone who is doing a website, if you can convert your images instead of jpeg is fine, it's, it's the lowest that you can get generally speaking. There is a next gen image format called WebP, so WebP. That is, that compresses the JPEGs even further. So I managed to get an image from about two megabyte down to about 60 [00:21:00] kilobytes, so yeah, I would definitely recommend, anyone converting their images to WebP and then uploading those to the websites, modern day browsers, all accept them. Um, for a while there it was a bit iffy as to whether or not it would work on all computers, but yeah, it's, it's at the point now where WebP is, it's, it's the image format that people are moving to.
[00:21:19] Adrienne Donnelly: If people are listening or watching and they're thinking, how is all this compression you know, especially when you're talking about image sizes going from eight megs, [00:21:30] you know, down to 20 kilobytes, and they're going, yeah, but what about the quality? Can you talk to that a little bit in terms of how, you know, we're not looking at blurry pixelated images. If you could just talk a bit to that.
[00:21:44] Sez Gower: So the main thing with the pixelation of images that you'll see is when you save, say if you had a JPEG image of just a, a normal size, but you saved it at like say 10 or 20%, it's ripped out so much of the data and compressed it so much. That's where you'll find the pixelation. Generally [00:22:00] anything of about 80% quality and up will be fine.
[00:22:03] Sez Gower: You shouldn't find too much of an issue there. The other thing also that really contributes to the pixelation and the quality of images. Is if the images, like the dimensions of size themselves are too small. So if you've got an image that is about, say, 300 pixels by 400 pixels, and you try to put it as a background on a page, which is going to be almost 2000 pixels wide, that's where you're going to see that pixelation. So it's really about being aware of [00:22:30] the size dimensions of the file. Knowing what you want to use it for, and then making sure that you've got them the right size. That's why I said with any backgrounds, I make sure that they're about sort of, you know, 2,500 pixels wide, because that's going to work for generally the widest of wide screen.
[00:22:47] Sez Gower: So they don't generally go much wider than that and then for any other images on the website, I generally have about 1600 pixels, so then I can make it smaller if I need be, but most images on a website are not going to be bigger [00:23:00] than that.
[00:23:00] Adrienne Donnelly: And so it's almost about starting with higher quality, larger file sizes and working back instead of, you know, trying to stretch the piece of material across the whole screen and it becomes wholly.
[00:23:12] Sez Gower: Exactly yeah and that's the thing that I ask all my clients too, when I'm getting them to send me all of their content. I basically say to them, high resolution JPEGs, please send them through and it doesn't matter how big they are, because I will look after compressing them and, and converting them as I need to and, and resizing them if, if possible. But it's so [00:23:30] much easier to start with a high quality image and resize it or compress it than it is to go from small to large. That is next to impossible, I have some tools as a photographer where I can sometimes increase the image using like AI generation and stuff like that, but it's not as good as starting with a really high quality image I use that in the absolute last resort,
[00:23:52] Adrienne Donnelly: Okay. That's really good to know yeah, and a great tip around starting big and, and, and working back.
[00:24:01] Adrienne Donnelly: Let's talk a bit about your clients and the work that, your business does. When businesses come to you, are they coming to you because you do WordPress, because they want a sustainable website because someone's recommended. Like do, are you finding that most people are coming because they share your values around the environment, or that's just a bonus that they find out afterwards?
[00:24:23] Sez Gower: I think at the moment with the recent, clients that have come through, it has been just more of [00:24:30] a bonus, that they've mostly come to me because I do WordPress websites that we share other values that are the same um, but then when I've said, well, it'll be an eco-friendly website, and they're like ah Yes. That's great. So I asked a client recently where I did a website in a week. Uh, it was for a tourism company who have, a party boat on the Gold Coast and I said to them, you know, I'll rebuild this website that's not a problem. Client loved the website and I said, oh, I forgot to tell you it came back with an A rating for carbon footprint.
[00:24:59] Sez Gower: And [00:25:00] they're like, we love that. So it was just, you know, it was sort of, it was just. The cherry on the top, basically. But they do love the fact that that is another option because, and what I'm finding with a business that I'm, creating a website for at the moment, they have as part of their values that they meet certain, criteria for like the, the sustainability goals set down by the UN and so having, you know, a sustainable website is, that's another tick in the box. That's just another way that they are reflecting their own values about sustainability in the [00:25:30] world. That, having a presence online that is both good for the environment or at least much less harmful for the environment than most websites and also, uh, accessible and inclusive for, for all of their site viewers.
[00:25:43] Adrienne Donnelly: It's such a great niche and such a great point of difference for you as a business owner, right? Where the people are coming to you 'cause they just know you're great at building WordPress sites or they're coming because from a, um, corporate social responsibility point of view, they're working with the UN's, [00:26:00] um, ES no,
[00:26:02] Sez Gower: Sustainability development goals. I had to think of term
[00:26:04] Sez Gower: SDG. I know. Yeah. But that is like, I've worked with clients where, you know, that is something that's built into their values. It's built into the mission of their business. They've selected ones that apply and they're making choices on the stakeholders. They engage the vendors, the suppliers that they use based around their work toward contributing to those UN goals. So it's such a incredible niche that you've [00:26:30] carved out for yourself. Do you ever get any pushback?Any pushback?not so far. It's funny actually, because I think particularly as I said before, with so much news in the media about the climate crisis, and it's not even so much just about the climate crisis, but people, people know that that is a thing, that climate change is real. You can just see over the world, you know I mean, at one point we had wildfires. Um, uh, in the, like, you know, three or four different places in, [00:27:00] in the Northern Hemisphere and then flooding in others, and it's just like, at no point in human history has there ever been this much, you know, this many natural disasters happening at once. it's insane how much is happening and it is because of the climate crisis, which has been created by man.
[00:27:19] Sez Gower: And I think people knowing that there is something that they can do, even if it's just something small. But I mean, the thing is, with some websites, with the number [00:27:30] of people that they get accessing their website, that's where it can really make a difference because instead of putting, you know, tons of carbon into the environment and into the atmosphere, they may only have a fraction of that like one 10th could be even less than that one 20th it does have an effect and it comes back to that thing that I said before of it doesn't matter if it's a small change, it's still a change. And the thing that I'm finding through this is that my love for the environment and my dedication and commitment to creating [00:28:00] these eco-friendly sites is inspiring other people. So it's also about having that flow on impact in that regard as well. That's something I'm so passionate about people are like, you know, that's a really cool idea. Let's, let's go with that.
[00:28:11] Sez Gower: there hasn't been any pushback so far, and I think in a way it's, it's kind of been the deciding factor for a couple of them. They're like, yeah, actually that sounds really cool and I mean, I'm also upfront about, as I said, to you before if you work with me, you're gonna get an eco-friendly website, even if you don't ask for one yeah, I mean that's, at that point, if they find that out, they're [00:28:30] like, yeah, nah, I'm not interested I wanna, you know, put so much more carbon into the atmosphere. At that point I'd be like, well that's probably not really a good fit. But, no, everyone has been really accepting of it and just, and, you know, excited in a lot of cases, which has been absolutely amazing.
[00:28:45] Adrienne Donnelly: What I love is that you're giving people that option to take steps forward in a space that can feel quite overwhelming sometimes and almost like too massive and what's, you know, little old me living in [00:29:00] this suburb, you know, trying to drink with plastic straws and you know, take reusable bags to the grocery store thinking, am I actually really making a difference? This is so drastic what we are being shown in the media. What I really love is you are showing people. How easy it can be without the overwhelm, but also then showing them, if you do this, this is what will happen. And so they're getting those real time results in terms of that grading structure and I [00:29:30] think then that spurs us on to go, oh, okay, like I can tell someone else about this. I can make a different decision I can be looking for those values in other people that I engage with in my business.
[00:29:42] Sez Gower: Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. I think probably the biggest thing that's come out of this is reminding people that it doesn't have to be huge, big actions. You don't need to be, you know, running an event that has hundreds of thousands of people attending where you're you know, like a rally or anything. It's all about [00:30:00] the little, everyday things that we can do that just make a change.
[00:30:03] Sez Gower: I mean, I was on a sustainability, um lifestyle sort of podcast, late last year, we recorded an episode and I was talking to Kat, the host about it at that point, and I said, it's just simple things like I am eating less red meat at the moment. The initial reason for me doing that was because, it was starting to affect my joints. I was seeing a lot of inflammation and my joints were starting to hurt because I'm getting old and so I thought [00:30:30] I'm gonna cut out the amount of red meat and I'm probably having maybe two thirds less red meat than what I used to. But then there's also an environmental impact on that because it means that I'm not eating as much beef, which is obviously a very large contributor to the carbon impact and whatnot on the environment.
[00:30:45] Sez Gower: So it's even just little small things like that like there are everyday things that we can do, turning off all the lights in a room when you leave it, making sure that all of your appliances are turned off when you're not using them, because even if they're plugged into the electrical socket, they're still drawing electricity from [00:31:00] the grid. It's just little things like that that can add up over time and they do make a difference, particularly if everyone starts doing them. And we're not saying that everyone should, but if, you know, people make five small changes to their daily lifestyle, tiny little things like that, it's huge the difference it can make over time.
[00:31:18] Adrienne Donnelly: A huge impact I can tell my dad will be loving that. He always used to yell at us', like, turn the lights off when you leave the room. So he'll be like, yes he's been trying to tell us for 30 years. Um, in terms of [00:31:30] this space, it's fast moving, it's evolving. We're still trying to work out what's happening, you know, to a degree with the climate. Where are you going? And this may be two, separate questions, but maybe the same answer. Are there any businesses that you really look up to that are doing sustainable websites well and or businesses or individuals that you go to for inspiration, for continued learning, for continued knowledge?
[00:31:59] Sez Gower: [00:32:00] So probably the biggest one is there is actually a website about sustainable websites. It was started by, I can never think of the guy's name and it's terrible, but he, he actually wrote the book, so to speak, on sustainable websites. But he also started the world's first sustainable website digital agency, Whole Grain Digital in London. So checking out what they're sort of doing, the people that they're working with, and then also you know, just making sure that I'm still aligned with, there's actually something out there called the Sustainable Web Manifesto, [00:32:30] so making sure that I'm still aligned with what they're trying to do in the world. Sandy is a great one, the one who I mentioned earlier, Sandy Dähnert from Green the Web um, she is one who I really look up to because she's actually got some really beautiful examples of low carbon websites on her website, like in her portfolio, best practices and that. So I like to sort of keep an eye on that to see what she's doing.
[00:32:53] Sez Gower: the interesting thing with this space is that, while it is really exciting, and particularly [00:33:00] because it's, it's, it is something we have to sort of stay ahead of the curve a little bit, it's interesting that there's not a lot of people in that area. Like when I actually do a search for sustainable website designers either in Australia or worldwide or you know, eco-friendly websites and stuff like that. There's not a lot that pops up. And the really sort of disappointing thing that I've seen with a lot of them based both in Australia and overseas is that they'll say something is eco-friendly, and they're not, like their own website. You run it [00:33:30] through a carbon calculator and they're coming back with like a D, E or an F grade, and it's like guys why aren't you, you know, walk the walk.
[00:33:39] Adrienne Donnelly: Yeah.
[00:33:39] Sez Gower: If you're creating these for clients, why isn't your own? Um, and I mean, I can't say too much at the moment 'cause my website is still under construction, has been for 18 months while I'm doing all sorts of things and helping clients with theirs. But it's something that was part of the reason why I took my own website offline and only kept up a few specific pages 'cause I thought, I don't want all of that sitting on [00:34:00] there being, you know ridiculously carbon heavy when I can just put in a bare bones website that will give them the information that they need and then stuff that they can check and I'll put out the rest at a time when I know that I have done the best that I can.
[00:34:14] Sez Gower: Um, so yeah, it's kind of disappointing seeing that there are so many other agencies. There's not too many sole traders that are actually offering sustainable website design or even eco-friendly website design and those that are just, yeah, don't really seem to be. The work that they're [00:34:30] presenting and including their own websites doesn't match up with what they're saying. So yeah, Sandy's probably my best in terms of inspiration and she's the one that I sort of follow and, and check out what she's up to. I would recommend if anyone is interested in just seeing websites that you can create that are eco-friendly and whatnot go to green the web.com and check out, I think it's called Best Practices or something, and she's got them all there and it shows what their carbon rating is and everything 'cause there's some really, that was where I was taking inspiration with [00:35:00] some websites that I've worked on.
[00:35:01] Adrienne Donnelly: Mm. Sounds like there is a very big share of the market available to you, my friend, because it doesn't, yeah, which is amazing.
[00:35:09] Adrienne Donnelly: When businesses come to you, are they looking for a whole new site? Are they looking for you just to kind of audit and provide recommendations and then execute those recommendations. Where are clients at when they're coming to you?
[00:35:22] Sez Gower: Most of the ones recently have been looking for a whole website refresh, like a new design and a new build. Actually [00:35:30] the, the white label client that I had where I talked about, we, uh, made huge difference to the carbon footprint that was specifically, I, I actually, I was just trialing a new service, which I'm just calling the eco-friendly site optimisation because it's all about optimising the site, so it's fast to load, it's got good user experience and everything, but that it's also lowering the carbon footprint. And that one started with an F carbon footprint and we got it down to an average. B minus, which I was really impressed with and part of the reason I couldn't do anymore is because it was a very old site and [00:36:00] the back end of the site, there wasn't too much that I could touch there. There were certain things that I could, and I was really happy with the result that we got.
[00:36:06] Sez Gower: But, um, we, we have sort of discussed about the possibility of actually rebuilding that site, with more up-to-date technology and that, which will make a huge difference. so yeah, it's, at the moment it's a bit of a mix, but mostly most of the ones that I've worked with this year, particularly in the last six months, have all been complete rebuilds. Some of them have been, they've had existing sites that they've wanted redesigned and rebuilt, and there've been a couple that haven't had [00:36:30] any websites before and they just want completely new websites. So, yeah, it's been a really, really good mix so far.
[00:36:35] Adrienne Donnelly: Yeah, sounds great.
[00:36:37] Adrienne Donnelly: If people are wanting to find out more information or talk to you about their current site, or potentially looking at, you know, moving over to something like WordPress so that they can start to make these positive changes, what's the best way for them to get in contact with you?
[00:36:51]
[00:36:51] Sez Gower: They can check out my website, there's not a lot there basically, the main thing is that they can see there's an inquiry form that they can fill in. There's also the portfolio, [00:37:00] which shows some of the websites that I've built. Interestingly enough, I realised last night I haven't actually updated that with any of the sites that I've launched this year. So that is something I do need to do but yeah.
[00:37:10] Adrienne Donnelly: To busy working on everyone else's
[00:37:12] Sez Gower: It's for real. Isn't that always the way
[00:37:14] Adrienne Donnelly: always the way.
[00:37:16] Sez Gower: their work always comes first, so, yeah no um, once, once I've got those up, there'll be a few more examples in there 'cause the ones that I've done this year have really had the focus on the eco-friendly side of things, so lowering the carbon footprint. So I'm [00:37:30] really excited to actually put those up so that people can see that yes, you can have a website that functions and you know, attracts leads and it looks good, and it's also lowering your carbon footprint. So yeah, that's what I'm really excited about.
[00:37:43] Adrienne Donnelly: We'll make sure we put all of those links plus all the other people and tools and tech that you've mentioned, in the show notes.
[00:37:52] Adrienne Donnelly: My final question, why do you love whales so much?
[00:37:55] Sez Gower: Why do I love whales so much?
[00:37:57] Adrienne Donnelly: As a fellow whale lover, I would love [00:38:00] to talk about whales. So listeners, you can indulge us here for a minute.
[00:38:04] Sez Gower: To be honest, I don't even know why. Um, I, I grew up by the beach like I grew up in this was. It used to be a completely little, tiny little town in Northern Rivers, New South Wales called Kingscliff. It's now basically something of a vacationing hotspot. It wasn't like that when I lived there. It was literally a little surf town, and I just loved living there. And I knew when I was growing up that the whales would go past, but I never actually saw one [00:38:30] the entire time that I lived there. When I moved up to Brisbane in the early two thousands, I took myself on my very first whale watching trip off, uh, Morton Island and it is funny actually going back over the photos now because I just had this tiny little point and shoot camera.
[00:38:45] Sez Gower: But I remember when I went back and looked at the photos, I was like, oh my God. We actually had a mum and calf, that was sheltering in Moreton Bay, just resting because they were heading back, uh, down south for the summer feeding season. That was really the start of it for me. So that was [00:39:00] 2007, and then from 2010 onwards, every year I have gone whale watching and I've done more and more trips. So I think probably the most trips that I've done in one season was about sort of 20 odd but I just love being out there. I love being on the water, having the sun on my skin, the salt air that I'm breathing in. But there is just something about the humpback whales in particular. I haven't had too many experiences with the other whale species, but the humpback whales are the gentle giants of the deep.
[00:39:28] Sez Gower: They are [00:39:30] amazing to watch. They can be playful, curious, um, when there's a competition pod going. Where they're you know competing for the rights to mate with a female. There can be some argy-bargy go on, which is so exciting to watch but I don't know. It's just this, just something. They are beautiful, beautiful animals. so yeah, and like, you know, middle of last year we moved up to Harvey Bay, the unofficial whale watching capital of the world and I just love being up here. I'm so excited for this season to actually be able to, you know, [00:40:00] take some half days and just go out on the boat for the afternoon. So, yeah, I've, I've been very, very lucky. With some absolutely incredible experiences, including, uh, three different, experiences with Migaloo but yeah, it's just, you know, I don't know, it's just, it, that's my thing. I just, I love being out on the water and, and, you know, experiencing nature like that firsthand and getting up close to it.
[00:40:22] Adrienne Donnelly: Oh, thank you for sharing and thank you so much for being on the pod. Honestly, I have learned so, so much and I'm like off to put all my [00:40:30] websites through the grading system and be like, right, let's get this sorted. Thank you honestly, you are an incredible wealth of knowledge, obviously extremely passionate about what you do, and yeah, really looking forward to learning more from you. So thank you so much for your time today.
[00:40:47] Sez Gower: Thank you so much. It's just, I, it's one of those things, I love being to talk about this because I get so excited about it. So I really so appreciate you inviting me on to, to have a bit of a chat about it. It's, it's been so [00:41:00] much fun. Thank you.
[00:41:01] Adrienne Donnelly: Thank you for listening to another episode of Seed to Success. Make sure you're following along so you never miss an episode. If you have friends in the VA or OBM space, feel free to share this episode if you think they may get something out of it too.
